tennessee
Jingle Boom (Presented by SPARKBOOM): An Interview with Cloud Caverns
The stories of Brandon Peterson and Dan Bouza emerge from East Islip, NY roots. Their history dates back 10 years when they lived less than 10 minutes away and attended high school together and their paths have continued to converged ever since. But it wasn’t until two and a half years ago (when Brandon approached Dan with a song he felt needed to be heard), that music became an entirely new operation for the pair. What began as two friends embarking upon a single-song recording experiment in a backyard-shed-turned-recording-studio, became a brotherhood. Cloud Caverns was born and “Unto Ourselves” became the earliest recording for the Blind Willow EP.
The Cloud Caverns name unites the extremes; that which lies both above us and within our depths. When Dan isn’t devoting his time to Cloud Caverns, he works as an engineer at VuDu Studios in Port Jefferson, and is involved in several other projects. Brandon has been dividing his time between his wife (they married just last week), the band, Hotel of the Laughing Tree, of which he is also a member, and moving to Tennessee.
Check out my recent interview with band members Dan Bouza and Brandon Peterson, to gain some insight into what makes this duo tick. You can also get to know Cloud Caverns by downloading their very own “Christmas Yet to Come,” (released, hot off the virtual press, exclusively for SPARKBOOM’s Jingle Boom: Holiday Bash), and joining us on Saturday, December 20th in the Huntington Arts Council’s Main Street Gallery, for this FREE event. As you listen to Cloud Caverns at this holiday event, with the gallery bedecked in festive decorations and original art, you’ll appreciate the season and the music in a new way. Oh, and of course, don’t forget to wear your best ugly sweater, so you can Jingle Boom, all the way.
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Lauren Jahoda: What are each of your roles in Cloud Caverns?
Dan Bouza: With Cloud Caverns it’s kind of hard to define roles, because Brandon and I–since it’s such a studio-based project– the two of us kind of do everything. So sometimes I’m playing bass guitar and keyboards, and sometimes Brandon’s playing bass guitar and keyboards. He does most of the singing and he writes the lion’s share of the stuff, and then I just come in and add a bunch of bells and whistles and production to it. And that’s how it gets made.
When you say it’s a studio project, are you referring to the band itself?
DB: Yeah, at least it started out that way. We weren’t playing a lot of shows and it was just me and Brandon in an old shed that I converted into a studio, writing songs and recording them.
Where is this shed?
DB: It’s in my Dad’s backyard, in East Islip. We have since graduated from the shed (laughs).
(laughs) What is the shed being used for now?
DB: It’s sitting empty and has all my books in it now (laughs).
What did you study in college? Was Cloud Caverns a part of the plan or was something else?
How long have the two of you been “Cloud Caverns”?
DB: I think it’s about two and a half years now. Brandon came to me with one song. It was the last song on the EP, “Unto Ourselves,” and we recorded that and he came back with 4 or 5 other songs, and that’s when I knew we were going to keep doing this and it would turn into something.
What affect, if any, did growing up on Long Island have on your music?
Brandon Peterson: Although I don’t think Long Island has had a huge effect on us musically, lyrically I think it’s definitely part of our core. We both grew up here and it’s always been home to us. So all the memories and stories we’ve cultivated growing up here, make their way into our songs somehow.
Why did you choose “Gypsy Loft” as the title track for the album?
Dan Bouza: I had just moved into a house that was previously occupied by a family of real life Gypsies. When I moved in, the place was a wreck. A group of friends, Brandon included, helped fix and scrub every inch of the place over a period of about two weeks. My bedroom was in the loft, which is where the majority of the album was recorded, so it seemed fitting.
Album Art: AJ Estrada
What are your plans, if any, for your next album?
Dan Bouza: We have about 20 songs lined up for the next album. We’ve been in pre-production/writing mode basically, since we finished Gypsy Loft, and we’re getting ready to start actually recording it next month. We’re pretty excited to get back into the swing of things.
How did your connection with SPARKBOOM come about?
Dan Bouza: A friend of ours had mentioned to Raj [Tawney] and Michelle [Carollo] to check us out when the album first came out. They reached out to us to play the after party at their screening of Mistaken for Strangers. We had a blast and realized that they’re really doing something special for Long Island.
Did you create “Christmas Yet to Come” specifically for Jingle Boom? If so, how did you come up with it?
Dan Bouza: We did. Brandon showed up with a demo one day after Raj had asked us about playing a Christmas song. Brandon wrote 95% of it, so it’s probably best if he answers how he came up with it.
Brandon Peterson: I wanted to write a Christmas song that transported me back to the 90s. I remember as a kid, the week of Christmas was the absolute best week ever. We’d be with our loved ones every night, go driving around to look at lights and decorations on other houses, see distant family members, etc, etc. I tried to channel all these manifestations into one song. It is also inspired by Dickens’ A Christmas Carol, hence the title of the song. It has to do with hanging on to old holiday memories, whilst harvesting new ones.
Listen here…
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“CHRISTMAS YET TO COME”
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And join us here…
SATURDAY, DECEMBER 20th
6 PM – 10 PM
Huntington Arts Council, Inc.
213 Main Street
Huntington, NY 11743
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LIVE PERFORMANCES:
Cloud Caverns, NonStop To Cairo and Robert Sloan
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SPOKEN WORD/POETRY:
Steven T. Licardi, Bri Onishea, James Kim, Frankie A Soto, and Meredith Nussbaum
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WINDOW ART:
Caitlyn Shea and REME 821
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Craft Beer courtesy of Saint James Brewery, delicious treats courtesy of Stella Blue Bistro, and yummy water by Hint Water, prize giveaways courtesy of Sip Tea Lounge and more!
THIS IS A FREE EVENT ($5 SUGGESTED DONATION)
Questions by: Lauren Jahoda & Andrew Kase
Be Here Now: An Interview with Jonah Tolchin
Since discovering and writing about Jonah Tolchin‘s Clover Lane in early July we’ve stayed in touch and agreed to schedule an interview when our schedules would permit. It had been quite some time since our first contact and upon realizing that we both would be attending AmericanaFest mid-September, Nashville was the obvious choice for where we would finally meet.
After Joe Purdy’s spellbinding set at the Mercy Lounge (see the pre-show interview below), the Heartsrings crew and I crossed 8th Ave. and headed over to Jonah’s 9 PM showcase at Third Man Records–Jack White’s extraordinary studio. We had been there the night before, as witness to amazing back-to-back sets by Frank Fairfield and Gregory Alan Isakov. Frank captivated the audience — a capacity crowd which included Gregory Alan’s fiddle player, Jeb, and Bob Boilen — founder of NPR’s All Songs Considered. It was the third time I’d seen Gregory Alan play in an 8-week period, and his performance, once again, simply astounded and enthralled. We were also fortunate to meet with Gregory and his band after the show (see Gregory Alan’s earlier interview below). For those of you who don’t know, Third Man Records is the location where Neil Young recorded A Letter Home, on Jack White’s 1947 Voice-O-Graph — the only one available to the public in the world (find out more on KEXP’s exclusive interview with Jack White here). Give Jack a call. You can record on it too, if you like. The elephant-head taxidermy which the American Pickers found for Jack (I watched that episode when it first aired), was hanging on the wall to the right of the bar, just in front of the elevated control room. Third Man is a special place indeed.
Tonight, as I mentioned, we were here to see Jonah Tolchin and his band. As they took the stage, (even before the very first note hit the air), we already knew that they were worthy to be counted among those who can say they have performed upon these hallowed grounds. One of my traveling companions, singer-songwriter, Bill Scorzari, commented on the ability of Jonah’s phenomenal guitarist, Danny, to seemingly effortlessly evoke the legendary Derek Trucks and even at times appear to channel Master, Duane Allman himself (yeah…Danny’s that good). It was also clear, from drummer Michael’s performance, how Michael’s formerly “temporary” position with the band (as a “sit in” for a prior performance) instantly became a permanent position. As for Jonah…well, 100 percent pure emotion exuded from every single pore of his body. In fact, I think I might have actually witnessed a split-second moment when just one single pore tried to catch it’s breath, only to have Jonah instantaneously identify and coax it back into service. The trio is a fascinatingly well-oiled machine. The absence of a bass player–a fourth-man (see what I did there?)–was only visual, not sonic. The additional instrument was unnecessary, as Jonah, Danny and Michael had it all covered somehow. This night was clearly made for Jonah Tolchin and his band, and it was as magical and profound as it gets.
That Friday night’s show was followed by a mid-day performance on Saturday during Americanarama in the courtyard outside Grimey’s/The Basement.The sun was at its peak, but Jonah and his band played as sensationally in the open air as they had the night before, inside Third Man’s blue-lit, cool-aired studio.
We spoke with Jonah after the Grimey’s show and walked with Danny to get some of that greenish kiwi lemonade from the “Mas Tacos” truck– a staple vendor that provided mobile sustenance throughout AmericanaFest (especially at The Groove the day before–where we had mucho Mas Tacos). Before leaving Grimey’s, Jonah suggested we reconvene outside The Wild Cow, a delicious vegan, vegetarian, gluten-free restaurant in East Nashville. We met Jonah, Danny, Michael and Blue (Jonah’s wife) there, and laughed about the weird looking Mexican restaurant across the street, with the sign outside that read: “No one loves Kanye as much as Kanye loves Kanye.” We walked to a quiet grassy area near a large rock pile and sat, comfortably getting to know each other better–which I found to be incredibly easy and pleasant, surrounded by this most inviting group of kind and genuine friends. Oh, and they were really funny too.
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Lauren Jahoda: Jonah, where are you from in New Jersey?
Jonah Tolchin: I grew up in Princeton, NJ.
LJ: That’s where you had your Clover Lane release party — how was it?
JT: Yeah. It was a lot of fun, like the dentist was there and my parents. The mailman, the mail woman actually (laughs). It was really nice. We’ve been on tour with Black Prairie and they just did…it wasn’t quite a CD release, but it was a show in Chris Funks’ hometown in Indiana. It was like the same thing, so it was cool. I like that home vibe.
Michael: And they’re great people. They’re super friendly. Nate, their bass player, has been sitting in with us and he’s amazing. They played last night. Same time as us.
LJ: I know it took 3-5 years to create Clover Lane. How do you write songs? Do you collaborate or is it more of a solitary act?
JT: Yeah. I would even say that writing Clover Lane was sort of a life-long process for me. There were ideas that I had many years before I recorded it that I sort of put together. And for me, songwriting until pretty recently has been a solitary thing. I like to go into a room where it’s quiet and it doesn’t really matter where it is and usually what will happen is I’ll get a feeling. A song for me is a feeling and that’s why I listen to music. It’s all about feeling. it’s all about emotions. What I’ll try to do is capture that feeling as best as I can through music and words. That’s the most important thing to me — the feeling. I wouldn’t consider myself a great lyricist by any means, but I strive to be good at capturing feelings and it’s definitely a learning process.
LJ: That definitely comes across when listening to your music — that feeling transfers to your listener effortlessly. Although it took a long time to create and release Clover Lane, I also read that you recorded it in just 4 days.
JT: (laughs) Yeah.
LJ: I can relate to that in some way, to finish my Master’s degree, I was required to write a thesis…
JT: Congratulations! That’s a lot of work!
LJ: Thanks! The process was very similar — I spent 6 months researching, reading book after book after book, but when it was time to write the paper it took about a week. It’s a strange feeling committing to something so wholeheartedly and for so long, and then to release all of that energy in such a short amount of time. What was that process is like for you?
JT: Yeah. It’s hard to describe. I mean, it’s the same thing when you’re ordering dinner at a restaurant and you’re waiting around and then your food comes and it’s gone in about 12 seconds (laughs).
LJ: That’s probably the best comparison I’ve heard yet.
Michael: …Especially at Wild Cow down here in Nashville (laughs).
JT: For me, it was a strange process because I actually finished a lot of the songs right before. Literally the week before, I got some of the songs ready and we went and recorded it in only 4 days. A few months later, the record got picked up and then there was this waiting period of about a year and a half. So since then, I’ve actually written a whole other record that’s about ready to go. But it’s interesting trying to keep these songs fresh while on the road because these songs have been on my mind and been played on the road for a few years now. Last night I played some newer songs and we’re just really feeling those right now because they’re new. Everything always changes. As people say, the only constant is change so we try to keep playing these songs that we’ve been playing for 4 or 5 years, whatever it is, and it gets kind of old after awhile, ya know. And you want to stay fresh.
LJ: I know the meaning behind Clover Lane is really strong, with the connection to and story of your parents’ home on Clover Lane — what is guiding you in terms of the new record?
JT: Yeah. About a year or so ago I thought of an idea to write and record an album that was based around the book Siddhartha and so there was about a year of time that passed and I didn’t do anything on it. I read the book and sometimes I’d think about it but not really. And then one day, this inspiration just struck and again, I wrote all the songs in a few days, all the songs, and now it’s just ready to go.
LJ: What’s your plan for the new album? Do you have a time frame in mind, in terms of release?
JT: As far as the release, I can’t really say. But for recording, I hope to record this December. Maybe in a church in Western Mass.
LJ: You have a place in mind?
JT: Yeah. There’s a studio that I’m going to check out at the end of the month and we’ll see. Hopefully, it’ll be the spot.
LJ: That’s awesome. Bill (Scorzari), who I manage, talked about recording some songs in this church that was built in East Orange, New Jersey in 1868. He’s building a studio in New York and for seating he bought some antique pews that the church had removed, and it sort of inspired this idea of recording there.
LJ: I know that your spirituality is a big part of who you all are, and everything you do.
JT: I guess the way I think about it is that it’s all there is. For me spirituality is reality and I’ve grown a lot as a person from being around Danny, who has his own path as well, and I’ve been really lucky that our paths have become one in some ways. Same with Blue. I’ve learned so many things from being with Blue because she’s very connected to what’s going on. I consider spiritually to be reality in the deepest sense of that word. Ya know, being here, right now, which we never are, ya know what I mean? And it’s been amazing because Michael’s been on the road with us and because, until recently, we’ve been playing with other musicians who aren’t. They’re not as focused or centered on who they are and they struggle, but with Michael, and from my experience, he’s just going, and he’s always here and now. And to be in the car with all these people who are just going and trying to live a healthy life and a conscious life, really is inspiring. It makes it a lot easier to be healthy and conscious. Ya know? Because if you have one negative polarity in the car or on the stage, it can bring down the whole ship. So it feels really good to be traveling with these guys and spending time together.
LJ: Yeah. You guys seem pretty lucky to have found each other. You really are so nice. It’s as simple as that.
JT: (laughs) You guys are as well.
(laughs)
LJ: I read somewhere that you’re a big fan of Game of Thrones. Are you all GOT-obsessed?
Band: (laughs) Yeah! (laughs)
Michael: Not me (laughs)
Danny: We’re getting him ready for Season 5.
JT: We gotta prep him (laughs). Well the three of us are living in a house in Bar Harbor, Maine, so when it came out every Sunday, we’d all watch it.
LJ: I do the same thing. How about True Detective?
JT: Ohhh yeah. True Detective.
Danny: What’s funny is everyone in the house would be like “Oh my god! It’s 9:30. Let’s go watch Game of Thrones!!”
LJ: It’s a bonding experience!
Danny: Oh yeah! And sometimes we’d be like WTF! Because we get so into it.
(laughs)
LJ: When I wrote about you a few months ago, you made a lot of effort to spread the article around to your friends and on your Facebook. Thank you for that. It’s nice that you give back to those who are writing about you.
JT: You’re welcome. Thanks for writing it. I definitely do my best to always do it. I guess these days with social media it’s kind of complicated. Say you get Three pieces of press that come out the same week or even the same day and you post them all that day, sometimes people will be like you’re talking about yourself too much, on your own facebook page. So sometimes you have to stagger things so I’ve been learning about the best way to do that. But yeah. Of course, I love to support people that support me. Ya know, we’re all in this together and doing it for the same reasons.
LJ: How did you end up in Rhode Island? Were each of you there as well?
Blue: Yes, after we graduated…I’m from Rhode Island…and after we graduated, we started living together so we moved there for a bit. We traveled a lot the first year after high school but yeah, that was our base for awhile and we just started doing open mics. The thing about Rhode Island that we always say that because it’s so small, there’s only one degree of separation, so anyone you see in Rhode Island, you know someone the same. So as far as stating out there, it was great because we were one person away from anyone in the state that we needed to know.
LJ: Michael, you hadn’t joined at that point yet right?
Michael: Not yet. We were playing some of the same places, but I was with a different artist at the time, so it all really came together this summer.
LJ: Can you tell me about some of your first monumental experiences in Rhode Island, either meeting someone or playing somewhere?
JT: Yeah. I think one of the coolest things that happened was we went to the Low Anthem CD release concert of Smart Flesh…I think it was the first time we saw Brown Bird…that was so incredibly inspiring. And we got to see the Low Anthem play..that was just ridiculous. That was definitely in the top 5 I would say. Then going to Newport Folk Festival was obviously pretty big for me, to be able to spend time there. And I just did a lot of open mics in the beginning. I just tried to play one every day, all the time. I did a lot of open mics (laughs). The way that I work is that I have hyper ADD about some things sometimes but if I just put my focus on one thing, I’ll just go and that’s all I’ll do. So when I decided I wanted to play music as a career, that’s all that I thought about and that’s all that I did and I found a healthier balance now, that the ball has started rolling down the hill. What I feel like is that I pushed this ball up the hill and now the work is all starting to pay off and I can relax a little bit.
LJ: Yeah. Everyone has their different moments of when they realize and decide to fully commit to that career. you figured out at a very young age that this is what you wanted to do, right?
JT: Yeah. Danny and I were in a band together at our high school. He was a senior and I was a freshman. So that was a really powerful experience for me, to be a part of something like that and to just be playing music a lot with friends. And I think it was after that probably that I got this passion and felt this confidence because you know as a freshman and coming into high school and being taken under the wing of a senior, is a pretty big deal, at the time. So that was really cool. It was a confidence boost thing. So I was getting all these signs about it and I decided to blow off school and play more music and not take the SATs and knew that I was going to do this. There was never a question. It was almost subconscious in some ways, like I never had anxiety about it or anything like that. I was just like, oh yeah, that’s what I’m going to do.
LJ: Danny, what was it that brought you to Jonah? Or did he find you?
JT: I think I bothered him quite a bit (laughs).
Danny: Yeah (laughs). It was really funny. So the year before Jonah came on a Sunday to the school to visit the school, to stay a night or two in the dorms and I had just got back from my parents house over the weekend and I was in my dorm room playing my guitar and my friend Tyler walks in and is like “Oh there’s this prospect student coming and he’s a guitar player.” So Jonah comes in and I think, I don’t know if he asked me if he could play my guitar or if Tyler told him he could play it, but I guess I gave it to him, but I really didn’t want to. I was thinking “Get out of my room you little twirper” (laughs). But um, then he played and I was like, cool…
LJ: …Alright maybe we’ll keep him around (laughs).
Danny: (laughs) Yeah, and in September, when school came around, for the first two weeks, Jonah would knock on my dorm room, because I would play guitar after school every day, and Jonah would knock on my door and say “Can I jam?” (laughs). For the first week or two, I didn’t really know what to think of it, but something happened where one afternoon i was playing and Jonah was in the library pretty far away on the whole other side of the campus and somehow he just knew I was playing and ran over and that’s when stuff started cooking. i mean, Jonah and i in high school both had an affinity for blues music from our dads and that’s a rare bond that you don’t find, especially when you’re a young teenager.
LJ: Yes. At that age, it is unique. As a young teenager, I wasn’t listening to this stuff yet.
Danny: The thing is, Jonah used to be, and always is like… he’ll surpass or get interested in something so much and then share those interests with everyone around him, at least in music. It becomes a collaboration of music styles, I guess.
LJ: A favorite question of mine comes from photographer/blogger/creator of Humans of New York: If you could give one piece of advice to a large group of people, what would it be?
Danny: Whatever you believe is your reality.
Michael: Remind yourself that your perspective isn’t the only perspective. If you can stay mindful of that it can help you out in a lot of situations.
JT: I just have so many things. They’re really all the same thing. I feel like there are so many people in the world that are trying to change the world. They’re trying to solve people’s problems and do all these external things to try to make the world a better place, but from my perspective, the only way to do that is by changing yourself, focusing on your own reality, your own mind, your own body. It’s all about interconnection, this universal mind, this universal consciousness. The only way we can really understand that is by meditating on that and caring about each other, but the only way you can do that is by caring about yourself. I think there are so many people who have this self-loathing and so many problems, and they don’t focus the lens inwards–that’s really the beginning of changing the world, by everyone changing yourself.
LJ: You can’t work on others until you work on yourself.
JT: You really just have to be the change you want to see.
Bill Scorzari: Yeah. I agree with that, and would add a lyric from one of my songs: Nothing can outlast patience and time.
LJ: Well, I can’t thank you guys enough. I want to hang out all night.
JT: Yeah, we’re around! (laughs) We’re going to Joe Fletcher’s show tonight at midnight.
LJ: I plan to be there too. I’m so glad I got to connect with you all.
JT: Likewise.
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Just before we parted ways, I noticed the tattoo on the inside of Jonah’s forearm. I asked Jonah about it and he explained:
“This is an idea that came to me, well, the triangle and the heart and the infinity sign just popped into my consciousness one day when I was sitting at a picnic table in New Hampshire, and then Blue sort of drew it all out for me because I’m terrible at drawing, and she made a cohesive piece and added the three triangles. The words are a reminder that I need to “BE HERE NOW.” It’s all I really need to remember…What’s that fucked up movie, is it Memento?…I kind of feel that way about being present.”
“The words are from the book title “Be Here Now” by Ram Dass…Of course these are just three very simple words that no one man has ownership over.” – Jonah Tolchin
Photo Courtesy: Jonah Tolchin
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Don’t miss Jonah Tolchin and Mandolin Orange at the Mercury Lounge in NYC this Thursday (Oct. 2)! Get your tickets here.
Close Knit Rockers: An Interview with Israel Nash and His Band
When I interviewed Greg Vandy, of American Standard Time and host of KEXP’s Roadhouse, I had asked him: “Who and what kind of music is currently playing on your iphone, ipod, radio, or in your car on your own time?” His response, simply and immediately, was “Israel Nash’s Rain Plans. Best album of 2014. If you like Neil Young at all…” As most do, I take Greg’s recommendations and leisurely listenings very seriously. I quickly turned to Rain Plans, the album I kept on hearing about, and fell under that 70s-inspired, yet modern and irresistible spell. Vandy was right — if you want to relive your Neil Young past time, Israel Nash is your ticket to reminisce, while also engage in what is distinctly current and trailblazing. Therefore, I jumped at the opportunity to interview them.
I met with Israel Nash at The Hatchery, located on the second level of the 4-story Acme Feed & Seed in Nashville, TN. We were joined by his band members, including Joey McClellan (guitar), Aaron McClellan (bass), Eric Swanson (pedal steel) and Josh Fleischman (drums).
The entire second floor is one enormous room with several bars and multiple groupings of comfortable, eclectic seating, from church pews to living room couches to high-back restaurant-style booths, and more. The decor is rural/industrial, if you can imagine it. The walls are covered in old metal printing plates with varied subject matter, pieced together like a mosaic. Old windows hang like pieces of art from the ceiling. It was a bright and comfortable setting for our meeting. We grabbed some refreshments from the bar and settled our large group into one of the booths. I was eager to speak directly with each of the band members to discover their personal thoughts and experiences during their time at AmericanaFest and beyond.
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Lauren Jahoda: What I love about this album is that it has the versatility to be played either really gentle or really soft, but when you’re live you have the ability to blow it out and play really loud. Do you agree with that? Is this intentional?
Israel Nash: That’s cool. Um. There is such a difference between making a record and playing live. They don’t have the same energy. I think it’s two different things, ya know. I mean live, we are louder, a lot louder than we are in the studio.
Band: At heart we’re all rock and rollers, so we all want to tear it up live.
LJ: Do you all come from a rock and roll background?
IN: Yeah! Classic rock, 70s era … these ideas of albums and legendary shows or whatever that is, we all kind of have a deep obsession with that.
LJ: That inspiration definitely comes through on the albums and during your shows.
IN: Yeah. Before we made the record we were obsessed with old records and had conversations when listening to those old records, like, “How do you make it sound like that?!” A lot of it is also comfort in a studio and being an artist and an understanding of how all this works. That changes a lot, ya know, from being a kid playing the guitar and making albums in a serious way, when it’s a committed project, ya know. So I think it was about discovering all these albums that we all liked and figuring out how to make it all come together somehow and in some way. We recorded the album to a 16-track Studer tape machine we got. We’re very much about the session. We all stayed at the house for two and a half weeks and just lived there and made the album.
LJ: So you just live and breathe the album for that period of time?
IN: Yeah and that’s how the guys used to do it. When you had these big legends who can just rent out these big spaces. And I feel like now in studios, you get your 10 hour block and you go back home and I like the idea of committing to it being all about the project. So that’s what we did.
LJ: Where did you record Rain Plans?
IN: In my house in Dripping Springs, Texas.
LJ: Did you build a studio?
IN: No. We did it in my living room. We basically just took all the furniture out. It’s a really big living room with tall ceilings and stuff and our engineer is in the room with us, Ted, and so we had a lot of gear but it looks like a studio…in the pictures and stuff (laughs). But, it was the house. The kitchen was behind a big tapestry that we put up. The idea was that we could all be there and chill out, it’s out in the country.
LJ: That’s great. I’m sure devoting that time together and creating the album makes the experience that much more meaningful. You recorded your second album, Barn Doors & Concrete Floors, in a barn in the Catskills, correct?
IN: Yeah.
LJ: We’re from New York, so we’re familiar with the area and love the Catskills.
IN: Oh really?
Aaron: It was right on the border of where Pennsylvania kind of bumps into New York. Right near the town of Liberty.
IN: I know that was a small town close by.
LJ: Yeah. Right by Route 17, I know it well.
IN: Yeah! The diner over there…what is it? The Liberty Diner?
Band: The Roscoe Diner.
IN: Yeah! The Roscoe Diner — it was probably only just a few miles from that place. Yeah, we found it on Craig’s List and it was just a house that had an old barn. We went up to the studio, or the house, with the engineer and we were like “we can make a record here.” So we just got all the stuff together and just lived there. So that was the first experience that I had with that. It was all these guys, except for Josh (laughs)…he’s forgiven me…but that was the first time to get into that for us.
LJ: Recording and being in an unconventional space like that…
IN: Yeah. It’s very serious to me. Ya know, I don’t care too much to be in the studio to make a record. I feel so much more comfortable in that setting. I feel the comfort. The comforts you have individually and shared…it goes into that. The spirit and good time. Making good music and being at ease.
LJ: I agree. That’s important. You will probably never do it the other way again.
IN: No way. Like “Joey’s gonna come in and lay guitar parts down at 3 or 4 o’clock!” – I know people make great records like that, but it’s just not me.
LJ: Since having done one album in a barn in the Catskills and Rain Plans at your home in Dripping Springs, TX, do you think you will do the next one in your home again or somewhere new?
IN: No. I’m going to build a studio on the land. That’s the plan for the next few months.
LJ: What kind of vision do you have for that studio?
IN: Well I don’t have very much money, so I’m building the cheapest building I can. There are these quonset arch buildings that come in kits, you can make one for 12 grand or something and all you need is a slab of concrete and a bunch of guys.
(laughs)
Band: (laughs) We’re still looking for those.
IN: The plan is to build a studio space that you could live in and eventually it would hopefully become open to other artists as well. We like analog-type studios that have places for people to live and we have 15 acres in the hill country, so just to be there for a week or whatever, and make records.
LJ: Israel, you’re originally from Missouri. Where are the rest of you guys from? How did you all meet?
Band: We’re all from different areas but we all lived in New York at the same time. That’s where we met. The three of us have all known each other for a long time, we’re from Texas originally…
IN: (joking) They used to be brothers.
Joey: We’re still brothers.
(laughs)
Band: Then we all moved to New York and we met Israel. We needed a drummer and that’s when we met Josh.
IN: It was close knit and ya know, these guys were all from Texas originally and we had played SXSW a few years ago and I just really liked the weather and the vibe. There comes a point when you’re in New York when you’re like “What do we do now?”…ya know. All of us had the same idea originally…like, we’re going to go to New York, live in the big city, which was great at the time.
LJ: Was your move from Missouri to New York spontaneous or planned?
IN: It was very short-planned (laughs). It was fairly spontaneous. I mean, we had enough time to plan for a garage sale and a few other things. So yeah, it was.
LJ: Did you feel there would be more opportunity for you in New York?
IN: Yeah…
LJ: You did find your band there.
Joey: We all had a fantasy of New York. Bob Dylan and all of the bands we loved were there…that’s like the pinnacle…New York is the place you want to be. It’s mysterious and all that so, we all kind of had a vision of what New York was.
Eric: It’s magnetic. I never had been to New York until 3 months before I moved there and I went there and I was like okay, I have to be here.
IN: I mean, it is a cool place to be, especially during that period of my life. Especially after you’ve been there for awhile, you know the city and you’ve developed friendships and that’s the most rewarding thing…developing the friendships and relationships that I’ve had the opportunity to get close to people you know and love. It kind of makes everything else easier.
LJ: We’re you guys on the first two albums as well?
Band: Not on the first album, but on the second one, yeah.
LJ: I watched your performance on KEXP and I remember that you were picked up by a small label in Holland and that the reception of your first two albums was a lot stronger in Europe than in the US. And with Rain Plans, there has been a tremendous and positive response from the US. Why do you think that is?
Joey: It’s like the age-old question – no one really knows the answer. We played in another band and we did well in Europe and we had the same issues as well. It’s like, ya know, you always want to make it in America.. it’s like the big prize. I don’t know why it is.
IN: I mean I think partially for what we’ve been doing, the team was evolving in Europe. There wasn’t really a team evolving in the states. There’s always the other side of what we’re doing, ya know, it’s not just playing music and writing songs, there are so many other people involved in Europe that had a team that hadn’t been developed in the states until the second album. I was just like, well, I got work in Europe and I play music for a living so I’m going to go there. I’m hoping to play a little more in the states and get a little work and I’ll be alright.
LJ: It definitely takes patience.
IN: There’s not much left (laughs).
LJ: (laughs) Well, you’ve played AmericanaFest so I feel like that’s pretty good.
Band: It was a great way to start off the tour for us.
LJ: You just played at the High Watt, and you’re playing again tomorrow at the Bootleg BBQ, right?
Band: Yeah.
LJ: I’m really looking forward to that. Where are you headed next?
IN: In terms of the tour or in terms of today?
LJ: (laughs) Both!
IN: I think we head to Knoxville on Sunday and then we are on tour until late October and then today…
LJ: Drink?
Band: It’s certainly a possibility (laughs).
IN: What day is it?
LJ: Friday.
IN: Yep, we’ll be right here (laughs).
LJ: It’s very clear with Rain Plans, that your move to Texas was a big inspiration for the album. What’s motivating your next album?
IN: I’m working on new stuff and we’re planning on getting into the studio in February or so for the new album. I think that move for me was way bigger than just a move…it was a life-changing thing for me on many levels, which has so much to do with the move but also so little to do with the move. As an artist, it definitely changes the music and what’s going on but I don’t think I need to move again to make an album or anything. The bigger thing is having the confidence and knowledge, I don’t know, I just have a much clearer idea of how it is…the expectations and different roles. Rain Plans was very much written with these guys in mind and the songs were very much about coming together and each of us giving pieces of ourselves to it and if you listen to the album and listen to each of these guys play and you’ll hear something completely different. It’s like wow, it’s someone owning their…it’s amazing to work with people who are serious about the craft…it’s part of you. Whatever it is…your passion. It’s fed by nothing else.
LJ: You look at people in the audience and they get it, the don’t take that for granted. It’s very much appreciated here at AmericanaFest.
IN: I think there is something really cool about…ya know, like last night and even today, there are people giving you compliments…it’s not like “hey, bad ass show. Cool guitar part.” It’s appreciative. That was our experience in Europe too. People thanking us for giving them something. It’s really great.
LJ: I really enjoy the song “Iron Of the Mountain,” can you tell me about creating that song?
IN: Um…I’m gonna make up something really cool (laughs). No, “Iron Of the Mountain” is a song about… iron represents blood and blood of the land and family and being married to the land in some way that’s bigger than us. That’s kind of what that song is about – and being on the road and being in the country and making up for lost time. It’s so simple, to me, ya know. As a songwriter, I like to just be honest…So that song is just about family.
LJ: It’s a great song.
IN: I’ll make some demos of ideas and share it with the guys and then before we make a record, like with Rain Plans, I sent them the songs and then re-sent the songs with just me on guitar because I don’t want to be like overly…I did these things so you should do those things. I don’t like to get into that. That’s the reason you have players here and all these guys like to play their instruments better than I can play their instruments, ya know. I feel like there’s some magic that comes together when people prepare music fresh and just kind of collaborate. I think with that song…(to the band) do you remember recording that song? I remember Eric because he has a big solo at the end.
LJ: Pedal steel is my favorite. It just stings you, ya know…
IN: Yeah…church in a box.
Eric: If you try playing one, it will quickly become not your favorite instrument (laughs).
LJ: I’ve heard it’s extremely difficult to play.
IN: Our European fans asked, is that a keyboard? (laughs)
LJ: How did you get into playing pedal steel?
Eric: Um, I’ve only played for three years. Basically, with Barn Doors, he had some pedal steel on it that I didn’t play on and when we went on tour and he said well hey, I’d love to have a pedal steel player and it was something I had always considered doing anyways, so I just learned it.
IN: Yeah. I didn’t even know he bought one. He said he got one and I was like, what?? With Rain Plans, I had this idea that I wanted pedal steel on every song because with Barn Doors, it was a post-album thing. It was like $150 for every song to get this guy on pedal steel. I thought, it’s almost done, we don’t need it yet. I really wanted pedal steel on this album and Eric does it in a way that’s really unique.
Eric: They don’t know that I really don’t know what I’m doing (laughs).
LJ: It adds a lot. It seems like you guys have a great dynamic going.
IN: I don’t like the idea of hired guns and these guys are changing… These guys are my friends and I just like making music and hanging out with them. Ya know it’s so easy for someone to make music and it be all about me. No one’s more important here. From you guys, to fans, we’re all here. People are just doing things. You need people around you that you care about and who care about you. I think once you find that, it’s alright.
LJ: That’s what it’s all about.
‘The Pleasure of the Present’: An Interview with Nathaniel Rateliff
Both Nathaniel Rateliff and I arrived late for his interview. Trying to find somewhere to park along the tangle of one way streets that surrounded our chosen meeting place during AmericanaFest, was quite the challenge the first few times around. Nathaniel walked up the ramp towards the front door of The Rutledge with his guitar in hand, as he was scheduled to take the stage shortly after our interview. He entered with his friends, who just happened to be Caroline Rose and her two band members. We met inside and as I introduced myself he motioned for me to follow and join him at the end of the bar.
We exchanged hellos and he offered me a drink, his treat (An “Americana,” beer, brewed by Yazoo especially for AmericanaFest.Thank you Nathaniel). Nathaniel Rateliff was warm and inviting from that first moment forward. He seemed as at ease and easy to talk with, as I imagine he would be in the comfort of his own home–an effortlessly entertaining host, candid, quick witted and engaging–and he continued as such, both throughout our interview and throughout his amazing performance on the Rutledge stage just moment later that evening. Grab a drink and come join us at the end of the bar for a chat, Nathaniel’s treat..
♦
Lauren Jahoda: The parking is crazy around here.
Nathaniel Rateliff: Yeah. It is. We lucked out with some spots on the street.
LJ: Tell me about your latest release.
NR: Well, it’s actually the third. The first one I did was self released with the help of some friends. That was called Desire and Dissolving Men. The second one was on Rounder Records….uh, there was so much time in between… it’s call In Memory of Loss. The newest one is Falling Faster Than You Can Run.
LJ: I love that album! I was a fan of yours before I started Heartstrings and became an editor.
NR: Awesome!
LJ: Is this your first time performing at AmericanaFest?
NR: It is. I honestly don’t know much about the festival (smiles). I actually didn’t know AmericanaFest was a thing. That goes to show how in the loop I am (laughs, and orders a drink from the bar).
LJ: (Laughs) How do you prepare for your show? Drinking (laughs)?
NR: (Laughs) Sometimes yes, sometimes no. A lot of times I am (laughs). But I try to keep it cool. I’m sure if anyone read that, they would laugh. They’d say, “You don’t keep it cool.” Yeah, I go through phases. I guess, it all really just depends on my mood and whether I’m in a good mood. I’m pretty lazy (laughs).
LJ: Do you prepare your set list ahead of time or do you just wing it?
NR: I’ll write something down. I’ll have a list of songs. We’ll see what happens tonight. There’s a bunch a new songs that I want to play.
LJ: Oh, I can’t wait to hear that!
NR: I just did a record with this R & B/Soul band I have, called the Night Sweats. I’ll do a couple of those. If I’m on tour with the band we kind of do similar stuff every night. It varies a little bit, but that’s the best way to lock in. Back in the day we used to…sometimes we’d be on tour long enough that we’d start making it up…”Yeah, we’ll do blah, blah, blah tonight.” And that’s really great sometimes, but sometimes ya know, it can backfire.
LJ: So when you’re performing do you stick to the same routine?
NR: Sometimes. The comedy parts change. Situational. Yeah.
LJ: I want to talk about “Still Trying.” When and how you repeat “I don’t know” over and over, it’s so emotional. Is that something you planned out when writing the song or did it just happen?
NR: I wasn’t necessarily trying to be extra emotive on those phrases. It just kind of came out that way so I’m just stuck doing it that way (laughs).
LJ: This might sound weird, but I think your album in every aspect is very sexy and romantic – the cover, the songs, the arrangement, the tone, the way you sing it – has anyone ever told you that before (laughs)?
NR: Um. I get told I’m sexy a lot.
LJ: (laughs) That’s a great answer.
NR: I mean it helps that I’m a good cook, great in the sack and I’m a good dancer. That’s my Tinder.
LJ: (laughs) Are you on Tinder?
NR: (laughs) No, I’m not. I’m married. Polyamorous, sort of (laughs). Ah, no. I was a big fan of Leonard Cohen and this sensual side to him. I like that. Sex is important. It’s important in relationships. It’s an important dynamic even for people who don’t even know each other. Not even just intercourse, just when communicating. It can have a real healing property to it.
LJ: Can you tell me a little about your background, where you’re from, when you decided to pursue your music career?
NR: I grew up in Missouri and ya know, did all that. I moved to Colorado in ’98. And I kind of always played music as a kid and was in bands, and I always wanted to be a rock star or whatever and moved to Colorado with my best friend, Joseph Pope, who still plays music with me. And so we sat at Red Rocks and said, “we gotta play here man!!” And now we’ve played there 7 or 8 times or so. Yeah, I’ve wanted to pursue music since I was a kid. I just didn’t know how to go about doing it. I thought I could do it without touring. I used to have a career job at a trucking company. I didn’t really have a high school diploma or a GED and I made good money at that job and I thought this is kind of as good as it’s gonna get. I could potentially make $40,000 a year and support a family and have kids someday. So, ya know, we’d tour on the weekends and my job was always helpful but at some point I thought, I need to take this really seriously. I started gardening and making the same amount of money, and I was able to come and go as I please. But it was a decision where I just had to be like, okay, I have to not be doing this trucking job anymore and do what I want to do. And I did that and yeah, it started to work out. But I mean it’d be 8/9 years and without any place to stand really (laughs). I was in South Carolina and we were saying that it only takes 7 or 8 years to make money but I’m still not making money.
LJ: Yeah. Everyone says the same thing.
Bill Scorzari: There’s that old saying: I’ve been working for years on my overnight success.
NR: Yeah. Just this last year, I was like oh yeah, the last couple of years we’ve made money. Of course, I don’t have any work at the end of November and December and I’m supposed to go to Europe in January so that’s going to put a damper on things. It costs a lot of money to get the band over there.
LJ: Yeah. Where in Colorado do you live?
NR: Denver.
LJ: I interviewed Gregory Alan Isakov the other day. He’s lives in Colorado and he’s a gardener too.
NR: Yeah, he actually got a degree in horticulture. He’s pretty interesting. He actually paid off all his tuiton because he started a gardening business on the side while he was studying horticulture. He paid off all his student debt before he was out of school. And he’s a great example of someone who’s been working for years and doing it his way and it’s paid off.
LJ: Yeah. It’s really nice being able to interview a handful of people who all know each other well and who respect one another so much. Something I love that you do when you sing is that you just speak, rather than sing. I love that. Is that intentional?
NR: I think it’s more of a Leonard Cohen rip off thing.
LJ: You really like Leonard Cohen.
NR: A lot. Yeah. My first record was more of the Leonard Cohen type of stuff. Yeah, I don’t know. I’ve always liked that kind of stuff.
LJ: There’s something very humbling about it. It feels much more like a one-on-one experience between listener and musician.
NR: Yeah.
(Nathaniel’s manager walks over just before Liz Longley’s set begins)
LJ: Well, I know you have to get ready for your show here tonight, so I just want to thank you for speaking with me.
NR: Oh, no. Thank you so much. Sorry I was late.
LJ: No problem. I’m looking forward to hearing your performance tonight.
NR: Thanks. Thanks for coming.
♦
We stayed for Nathaniel’s incredible performance on the Rutledge stage, where he effortlessly captivated the crowd with the candor of his music and wit–a fully engaging host and consummate performing artist. After talking with Nathaniel and experiencing his live show, I can’t help but marvel at the dichotomy of this incredibly talented and engaging man so passionately singing “I don’t know. I don’t know. I don’t know a God damn thing.” Nathaniel knows a lot about what’s important in life, and it’s clearly what he knows that is the force behind his music. The next day I arrived at the airport, picked up a copy of the New York Times outside security, got on the plane headed to my home in New York, sat down and began reading. There, within the first few pages of the Sunday Review, was an article entitled Too Young to Die, Too Old To Worry, written by Jason Karlawish. In the article Karlawish talked about Leonard Cohen and how Cohen had, as planned, resumed smoking at the age of 80, after having quit for so many years. Karlawish posed the question — “When should we set aside a life lived for the future and, instead, embrace the pleasures of the present?” — a question that all of the musicians I interviewed during AmericanaFest expressed they have confronted at one time or another; a question that we all have or will confront at one time or another. It is no trivial question. It is in fact, weighty, and profoundly so. While Nathaniel’s former job at the trucking company gave him security, he instead made the decision to actively pursue what he wanted to, and risked it all to be able to fully embrace the passion that drives him instead– his music. It’s a decision for which we, as listeners, are extremely grateful.
A Cup of Joe: An Interview with Joe Pug
One of our favorite places to visit while at Americanafest, was Crema—a cozy and bright Coffee shop, located slightly off the city of Nashville’s beaten path. If you’re ever in Nashville, make it a point to visit Crema and sample their “hand poured” (brewing technique) coffees. I recommend the Ngila Reserve with apricot. No need for dairy or soy or sugar. Sooooo good! This was the setting for our much anticipated interview with Joe Pug. Joe was gracious enough to delay his travels to his next performance (in Louisville) so that he could meet with us. By the way, Joe also takes his coffee black and we’re glad to have had time for a cup with Joe.
♦
Lauren Jahoda: I was speaking with Gregory Alan Isakov just last week and your name came up. He mentioned how much he loves you. What great friends you are.
Joe Pug: Yeah, we are good buddies.
LJ: He seems like the sweetest guy ever.
JP: He is but he has a real wild streak too. We run into each other…we cross paths quite a bit and every time we do, we just end up staying up really late and drinking way too much and having to go to our respective gigs the next day (laughs).
LJ: Have you ever played a show together?
JP: We played, um, like this weird songwriter thing that was in Denver a year or two ago and that’s where we first kinda touched base. We’ve just run into each other a lot since then.
LJ: Yeah, you, him, the Tallest Man on Earth and Newport Folk Festival sealed the deal for me. I couldn’t escape the pull of this music after that.
JP: That’s great. That’s awesome.
LJ: When you and I met the other night, I had mentioned that I was at your show a few years ago at the Mercury Lounge when you had Anthony D’Amato open for you. I remembered after our conversation that Will Arnett attended that show. I’m sure you get musicians attending all the time. What was it like having him show up?
JP: Me and the whole band, we were all…I literally cannot think of a person we would rather have just randomly turn up at one of our shows. We all love him and all of his work. The Arrested Development stuff…that Blades of Glory movie…all that stuff, man. It was really cool. He just came back…he bought all of the merchandise we had. He left the club with his arms stuffed full of it (laughs).
LJ: Was he a fan before the show or did someone recommend that he go?
JP: A friend of his played some songs for him in California and then he was back in New York and he either lived or was staying near the Mercury Lounge and we were playin’ so he just stopped by (laughs). Yeah.
LJ: That’s so cool. What I love about what you do is that wherever you’re playing, you find someone within that area to open for you and provide them with such a great opportunity. At the Mercury show, you went on stage very late because you had two people open for you. It’s great that you give people the opportunity to get their songs out there.
JP: Yeah, yeah. That’s how it works. People gave me that hand up, so I give to other people too.
LJ: Yeah, reciprocation.
JP: Yeah.
LJ: I want to talk about your Dad a bit, if that’s okay.
JP: Yeah.
LJ: You said he was a musician, which I didn’t know when I met him a few years back at your show. Can you tell me about his music career?
JP: My Dad played all through his 20s and early 30s. He played in a regional band. They were called Sky Cop. They were really inspired by The Band. That was a major inspiration. He was a piano player…he is a piano player. He still… when he had me, he went to work as a carpenter. He did that for about 20 years and then when I went to college he went back to school, got his bachelor’s degree and became a 1st grade teacher. He’s an absolutely unique and inspiring individual. He’s like my, my, main role model. He’s a really cool guy.
LJ: When I met him, he was extremely nice. Very welcoming.
JP: Oh yeah. He has a sort of a quiet charisma about him that everyone gets to know.
LJ: I went to school to be an English teacher but I decided not to pursue that career. It’s so difficult to get a job doing that.
JP: It is. My wife-to-be is a teacher as well. She’s an English teacher. She plays music at night and does this during the day. My dad tells me it’s really difficult.
LJ: Most people don’t realize that you bring work home with you. That’s the thing. You live in Texas right?
JP: Yeah, we live Austin.
LJ: I haven’t been there yet. I’ve been wanting to go.
JP: It’s a great place.
LJ: It’s definitely on my list of places to go. I read that you left college just before your senior year. What led up to that decision?
JP: Yeah. It’s funny. When we were on the last tour, I was with the band, we were all in the van with this guy David Ramirez…
LJ: Oh we love him! We’re going to see him later tonight.
JP: He’s great.
LJ: Yeah. He’s special.
JP: He’s very special. In more ways than one. It was like the 4 or 5 of us in the van and we’re talkin’ and one of us was like, “Yeah, I dropped out of college…” and then another one said it and we realized that everyone in the van dropped out of college (laughs) and so then it got kind of quiet and I forget who said it…I think it was our guitar player Greg…he said “Yep and now we’re sitting in this van right now and this is pretty much where all our parents told us we would be if we dropped out of college (laughs).
LJ: (laughs) It seems like everyone is very content doing it.
JP: It’s the best. It’s… There’s no money in playing music anymore, so it’s about having a calling and you do it because you enjoy it and it’s the most meaningful way you can spend your short years on this earth.
LJ: Everyone I’ve spoken with says the same thing. It’s not about the money.
JP: Yeah.
LJ: What were you studying in college?
JP: Playwriting.
LJ: I knew it. I just finished my Master’s degree in English Literature, so I love the fact that you were/are into that.
JP: Oh cool.
LJ: Do you still write plays?
JP: Nah. I’m more of a…I have to really stick to one thing and concentrate on that. I’m not a very prolific creator in that way. If songs are what we are doing, I need to just slowly concentrate on songs.
LJ: I read somewhere that you said something along those lines – that you only had enough creative juice to get the songs out.
JP: Yeah. That’s pretty much it.
LJ: I had a couple of ideas with the playwriting thing (laughs). A friend and I were we’re tossing around the idea of you writing the music and lyrics for a play – that’s sort of the happy combination of the two (laughs).
JP: Musical theater. There ya go (laughs).
LJ: It seems like you are very much into poetry and literature. I read somewhere that you’re a big fan of Walt Whitman.
JP: Yeah.
LJ: We’re actually from Walt Whitman’s hometown in New York.
JP: Oh really?
LJ: You wouldn’t believe it but, there’s a huge mall there that’s called the Walt Whitman Mall, which is a complete contradiction to everything that was Walt Whitman (laughs).
JP: Sounds like a nightmare.
LJ: It’s a complete nightmare. What are you reading now?
JP: I just finished….I’m reading all non-fiction these days…and ah, I just finished Timothy Tyson’s Blood Done Sign My Name about the later era of the Civil Rights Movement, and now I’m started to read a book The Warmth Of Other Suns. It’s about the Great Migration. Black Americans coming up from the south up to the northeast and Midwest during the middle of the century. It’s really good stuff.
LJ: Yeah, I’ve delved pretty heavily into the Emmett Till story myself and it stays with me always. It changed me.
JP: It’s one of the most iconic and horrifying moments of our nation’s conscience. All those pictures were published in Jet Magazine, from his funeral.
LJ: His mother is the most brilliant woman in the world because, if it wasn’t for her, no one would know about it. She made sure to bring it to everyone’s attention.
LJ: We love your newsletter. It’s really refreshing to see and hear about what you’re doing.
JP: I like doing it. It’s really good because the type of music I play. … I think the best way to put it is that I would literally sit down and drink a beer with 95% of the people who come to our shows. Ya know what I mean?
LJ: Yeah.
JP: They are some really cool folks. It’s like a community. They really are. I really feel like I just travel around the country and there’re these people who have a similar world view as I do and we go to the same place and drink a bunch of beer and hang out. It’s a great thing.
LJ: It is. We keep coming back to this idea of the Americana ecosystem. Everyone finds and relies on each other. That’s why we love it here so much.
JP: Yeah.
LJ: Everyone is so embracing. It’s really nice.
JP: This festival is in a really good spot. It’s not too small and not too big right now. I don’t know how you keep something that way but this is definitely…I had a great time this weekend.
LJ: Is this your first time here at AmericanaFest?
JP: No. About 3 or 4 years ago we were nominated for somethin’, so we came, but even then it was a different vibe.
LJ: I know we’re short on time, and I just wanted to ask you… the hymn songs are my favorites, always have been… what’s the story behind naming them hymns?
JP: Well, I just think the reason I named those three songs that is because they are cut from the same cloth. I did one and then the other two just came.
LJ: Is the 101 some kind of reference to like a first course, as in school?
JP: Ya know, I don’t know. I had someone ask me once…His thought was.. are those the highways you were riding on when you wrote those songs? And I was like damn, I really wish that was the answer to that question (laughs).
LJ: That’s great! Just say “yes” (laughs). That’s exactly it (laughs). Seriously, they’re amazing, they’re stunning.
LJ: Well, I don’t want to keep you. I know you have to get going. Thanks so much for taking time out to meet with us. It really was a pleasure speaking with you
JP: Yeah. Well, it was great to meet you too.
LJ: Thanks Joe. So, where are you headed now?
JP: We’re going to Louisville right now.
LJ: Well, good luck with everything.
JP: Thanks. You too. Take care.
♦
My interview with Joe Pug was special to me. In speaking with him and with other artists at AmericanaFest, it was clear that they share a thriving brotherhood, a mutual admiration of each other’s craft, and a genuine appreciation of who they are as individuals, friends and fellow travelers upon the Americana trail. This Americana community has so much to offer to every fan, every venue, and every city or town that is fortunate enough to be embraced by it. It is self sustaining in the most wonderful way. It’s focus on the inherent worth of the music it brings, leaves no room for greed or pretense, and instead, creates bonds of friendship. And what more could anyone ask for… besides a great cup of Joe?
‘My Hillbilly Confidence’: An Interview with Joe Purdy
I was very excited to receive an email from Ryan, about setting up a Heartstrings interview with Joe Purdy. I’ve been a fan of Joe’s music for quite some time and welcomed the opportunity to speak with him about what drives and inspires him. I called Joe’s cell phone. It rang and rang and then I heard: “Hey, this is Joe. Sorry I missed your call. But I’ll get right back to you, so leave a message. Thanks.” My first thought was that I won’t leave a message, and instead I’ll give him some time and try again in a few minutes. So I hung up without leaving a message and called a few minutes later hoping he’d pick up, but ready to leave a message for him for a call back if he didn’t. Again, the phone rang and rang and again I heard: “Hey, this is Joe. Sorry I missed your call. But I’ll get right back to you, so leave a message. Thanks.” In the silence that followed as I waited for the beep, I got ready to leave my message. But instead of a beep, suddenly there was Joe’s voice again. The message continued: “…That’s possibly a lie. I may not get back to you for a while. I’m actually not very good at that sort of thing so, if I don’t get back to you at all, don’t take it personally. It’s just that I don’t know how to work my phone very well. But regardless, thanks for calling and, ah, I will talk to you at some point in the future.” I appreciated his candor and again readied myself to leave a message. Again, I waited for the beep. But instead of a beep, a voice came back. This time it was a woman’s voice: “The mailbox is full and cannot accept any messages at this time. Goodbye.” I heard a click and the line went dead. I had no other way to reach Joe for the scheduled interview. What to do?
Well, as it turns out, it wasn’t Joe’s fault at all. I simply got the interview time wrong when accounting for the different time zones. The full mailbox can also easily be explained by Joe’s popularity. Thankfully, it was no lie, and Joe was true to his voicemail word. We would indeed, talk some time in the future. In fact, although when I called again, at the correct time, I got Joe’s voicemail again, Joe immediately called back and I was ecstatic!
Here’s what happened next:
Lauren Jahoda: Hello.
Joe Purdy: Hi! This is Joe Purdy.
LJ: Hi Joe! How are you doing?
JP: No complaints, no complaints. Kind of a busy day. Sorry I missed you. I was in the middle of a radio performance. I’m actually in my hometown tonight. We’re passing through and I got a chance to go out and visit my folks with the guys and see my sister who just had a little one. My first niece. I was here recently for that, but she is six weeks old now and I just love to get my hands on her every chance I get. She’s a sweetheart.
LJ: Congratulations!
JP: Thank you so much. Our family is just so happy.
LJ: Where is your hometown?
JP: Well, hometown…it’s more of an area, it’s called Hickory Creek, Arkansas. I went to high school in Springdale, Arkansas and I’m about a relative distance from Rogers, Springdale and Fayetteville, where the university is, but we’re playing in Fayetteville tonight, and the University of Arkansas is here. Springdale is next in line over and that’s where I went to high school.
LJ: It must be great being able to come back and play there.
JP: Yeah, ya know I haven’t played here in about 8 or 9 years so it’s a little wild (laughs).
LJ: Do you expect to run in to people from your past?
JP: I imagine I probably will (laughs). It’ll be quite a reunion. I missed our 10-year reunion and yeah, it’s going to be 15 or more now. And yeah, I know a lot of those folks are coming out and I still have a lot, well I wouldn’t say a lot, I still have a few friends I still keep in touch with regularly. But, yeah, I expect to see a lot of old faces.
LJ: That’s great.
JP: Yeah, it’ll be nice and it’s just nice to see my folks and have an excuse to see my family again for a little bit.
LJ: I know you’ve been cranking out albums for the past 10 years, so I’m sure it’s been a busy road.
JP: It has! Yeah. It’s going to be a little strange tonight because I haven’t made it back to play in town, it just hasn’t fallen on the roof in quite awhile. Just routed around, just things schedule-wise, have just always kind of gone the other way of our favor and not been able to pop in. So, it’s really nice to be able to this time.
LJ: I know Arkansas, is a big part of your life – it’s where you live, it’s where you’re from – you hear about it a lot when doing research on you. I also heard you are quite the local history buff. Is that true?
JP: Oh, no, hardly. I wouldn’t take credit for that (laughs)!
LJ: (laughs) Well I’m glad I checked with you then (laughs)!
JP: Yeah, thank you. Yeah, no, no. I wouldn’t say that so much. I mean I do, I have done my share of snooping around local history for sure, but I wouldn’t say I was a buff by any means.
LJ: I’ve never been to Arkansas, so I was wondering if there is any sort of cool history that you could tell me about the area or a personal story.
JP: Well, the name of my label is called Mudtown Crier Records and where that kind of comes from is the town name technically, that my folks’ house is in is called Lowell and what that used to be called, what they used to call it was Mudtown, for obvious reasons. And when people would come through there, through the main section of town, way back in the day, they would park their wagons over night and in the morning they’d come out and they’d be sunk in the mud and they’d have to take the wheels off and do, ya know, all that stuff and it got to be one of those things where it was such an issue that they ended up going by the name Mudtown. That’s kind of where I got that. There’s this old-timer called Elza Tucker and he’s probably 94 or 95 now and he worked at the Lowell historical museum and the only time he ever left town was World War II to serve under General Patton. He worked everyday in the historical museum and I’m afraid to bring that up because I dont, I haven’t gotten to check in on him in a couple of years, but last time, he was doing great last time a couple years ago when I went and visited him when I was still in town. I ended up looking up, about the area that I was in Hickory Creek and he was a postmaster up in, I think he retired in 1973, and his father also delivered… in a pony express like wagon before that…the mail by wagon out to our area, and if you know our area, it’s quite a ways out there and it would come I think once a week at that point. But even when he was postmaster, he would take things out there, he would take the mail out there and he had for certain families that were across the river there, and they would boat over to get their mail at a certain time and he met them and handed them their mail (laughs). And ya know, there’s a bunch of, he told me some great old stories about some of the houses that are still standing. There’s a not a lot of them that are still there that were there way back in the day. We haven’t taken as good care of our buildings as a lot of the East coast has, but we did, we were able to have a few still standing. He told me a bunch of great stories about that stuff.
LJ: Is that also because of the weather and storms you get there?
JP: Partly, yeah. It’s partly because of that and it’s partly because of neglect and partly because of um, I think the idea has been a little bit more of build something new, leave the old farm behind. Build a new house, build a new barn, one that’s state-of-the-art, one that stays, ya know. I surely don’t want to be in a situation where it looks like I’m bad mouthing anybody. It’s fair, the reasons are fair, but it’s just a shame because there are some really beautiful farm houses and beautiful barns and beautiful old historical buildings that have been highly neglected and it gets to where you just don’t recognize the place anymore and it would be nice to have some of that around and drive through. Even in Kentucky and Tennessee and Virginia and places like that, you get to see so much of the countryside and you see these farms, full-functional farms that have been there for a hundred years or more and they’re just maintaining what they had and they’ve always been taking care of and repairing and taking care of them and they’re just, to me, they’re so much more unobtrusive to the natural landscape of the place. It just fits to me, and it’s just more beautiful to look at and I have a sense of preservation and a sense of pride behind it and I don’t know, I guess, I’m just sort of old-fashioned like that.
LJ: They become part of the landscape.
JP: Yeah, absolutely, absolutely.
LJ: I do want talk about your music. I’m genuinely interested in the history because, like I said, I’ve never been there before and I take any opportunity I can to get to know something new and interesting.
JP: Well, ya know, the Ozarks are a beautiful place and ya know, this time of year, right now, they’ve had a really good summer and it hasn’t been nearly as hot. It’s been very mild compared to a lot of other summers we get and so everything’s still really green and beautiful here right now. A lot of rolling hills and a lot of beautiful woods, beautiful rivers and lakes. Ya know, it’s a lot of wide open country still, and that part of it is special and it’s really, when you’ve been gone away from it awhile in a city and you come back, it still surprises you, even though you know it’s there, it surprises you. Even if you’re not driving, or even if your flying it…everything starts to get greener and buildings start to get further apart from each other and you start to see more trees, more hillsides, more streams of water and ya know, it’s a beautiful place. It’s a beautiful place to grow up too.
LJ: I love that. I grew up and live on Long Island in New York. I don’t know if you have ever been here, but we don’t have much of that here.
JP: Right. Absolutely.
LJ: Thankfully, we don’t have to go too far to get it. I went to school in upstate New York and it’s there.
JP: Oh I’m a big fan, big fan of upstate.
LJ: We’re you in upstate New York a lot?
JP: Yeah, I have been over the years. Sure, we do a a benefit concert for the St. Lawrence River every year on 4th of July in Craton, NY, Thousand Islands region and Save the River is an organization that got started by a group of people and Abbie Hoffman when he was kind of living up there and hiding under a different name. They had this really long, kind of scientific name for what their organization was going to be and it was like nine letters long or something and he’s like, “How about Save the River?” (laughs) And they’re like, alright, so, anyway we’ve been, I guess the last 10 or 11 years, we’ve been doing a concert up there to raise money for the Save the River organization, which is always constantly fighting legislation, because there’s a channel through there where traders come through and the commerce is good, but they are always constantly fighting to widen the channel so that they can fit more than one at a time through. But if they do this, they’re gonna knock out, they’re going to majorly disrupt the ecosystem, but they’re also going to wipe out 700 or 800 of the islands. And so, it’s kind of, it’s always a fight and a struggle for this commerce and they understand the need for the commerce as well. It’s not as one-sided as you might think it would be with one side against the other. They really are a great organization, who are really understanding of everything that is going on around them, but they’re constantly trying to maintain the balance and it’s one of my most favorite places in the whole, wide world –the St. Lawrence River and the Thousand Islands region. It’s just one of the most beautiful places that I know, so that we always want to do everything we can. First of all, it’s just a pleasure to get to go and be there, but second of all after that, it’s just we want to make sure that we keep getting to go back there, and we want to make sure that everybody can and that it doesn’t get disrupted to the point when no one can go.
LJ: I’d love to check that out.
JP: Oh you should, we put it on at the Clayton Opera House and it’s mostly people that live there and people who have homes that they go to in the summer time, and in the winter time it freezes over and there’s not nearly as many residents year-round. Although, there are more and more now, as the folks have gotten older, ya know, there’s houses that have been in families for generations and stuff. It’s the country and it’s more than the country, it’s a river and it’s navigating it, and building or living on the little river island somewhere, it’s a very humble sort of existence, but a really beautiful one and one very worth it.
LJ: I’m definitely going to look into that. I want to cover that in Heartstrings.
JP: Yeah! Absolutely!
LJ: You play there every year, right?
JP: Yes ma’am. I’ve got some great amazing, old stories that come from that area.
LJ: Yeah. I’m definitely going to look into that. I’ve been a fan of yours before I even started the magazine. It all got started with “Worn Out Shoes.”
JP: Oh, nice! Well, thank you, thank you.
LJ: A couple of years ago, I decided to pick up the banjo and I hate to say that I didn’t continue it, but I was taking lessons and the teacher said to write down 3 songs that I’d ultimately like to learn. I know it’s the mandolin on that song, but I just wanted to learn it on the banjo so bad.
JP: Oh, it’s real simple on the banjo! It’s about as simple as it is on the mandolin. I can teach you how to do that.
LJ: I would love that! I love that song.
JP: Oh, thank you. Thanks so much!
LJ: Is there a story behind “Worn Out Shoes”?
JP: I was driving through Colorado with Brian Wright, my buddy – great singer-songwriter – we’ve been around the world together many times. We were, gosh I think that tour awhile back we were opening for Edie Brickell, I was opening for Edie Brickell and he was accompanying me and we were driving in a car, in this SUV rental with the sun roof, driving through Colorado on this really gorgeous night. We had been on the road for a long time and you could see all the stars up through the roof and he was taking his shift driving and I had a mandolin in the passenger seat and just started playing ya know around with it “the hole in the roof for stars to fall in…” and then we started singing it together and then it got to the next verse and we kinda spit lyrics back and forth, and then he spit the next verse with “the devil is three steps behind…” and this stuff. Anyway, it was kind of the first and one of… the only time I’ve ever co-written, and it just happened to be that we were both… and he’s one of the only, if not the only person in the world that I would actually want to co-write with, and just because when we do it it’s an accident, it’s not a sit down and decide to write a song. I just can’t, I don’t understand that, and I can’t do that. But yeah, we were just drivin’ and singin’ together and it came about and so, soon after that when we were overseas for another tour we stopped in–we were traveling with Tom McRae and Will Golden and B. Wright and I– and we all stopped in outside of London and made a record, made You Can Tell Georgia in a few days, 3 or 4 days. So B, B was the other person that was on that. He was playing the 4- string or 6-string, whatever it was, and I was playing mandolin and they put a microphone up above us and we sang up to it and that was it.
♦
At Joe’s performance on Friday night at the Mercy Lounge in Nashville, we witnessed just that — Joe Purdy and Brian Wright reunited after years apart, singing “Worn Out Shoes,” reliving that moment when they had sung right up to that microphone above them in the recording studio outside London many years earlier. I believe that, Joe, Brian and I were quite possibly the only one’s aware of the history and sentimentality behind the moment of their performance of “Worn Out Shoes” that night, but the artistry and friendship shared between them was undeniable to everyone. We were fortunate enough to capture the incredible moment here:
♦
LJ: That’s so interesting because I have to tell you – last week, I interviewed Gregory Alan Isakov and I mentioned, as I am now, some of the songs that really stay with me. I mentioned one or two to him and they were two songs that he wrote collaboratively. It’s funny because I’m beginning to notice that my favorites are falling under this co-write category. Gregory had also expressed that he was particularly fond of those collaborations.
JP: I feel like it has something to do with, ya know… I’ve always had a bit of a spike from that one. Especially, he [Brian Wright] is out on tour with me now, and we haven’t played it together for years and years, if really ever and live, and we’ve been doin’ it in this recent show and it’s been going over so well. I started that song. I started the first verse and chorus and then we started finishing the rest together, but I think it has a little bit of a tinge of something that’s a little bit different than the stuff that maybe I do all by myself. So maybe it sticks, spikes out a little bit.
LJ: I love it. Is he going to be with you at AmericanaFest?
JP: He is. Yeah, he lives in Nashville now. Um, and spent the last couple of years with family and he played a little showcase last year but yeah, he’ll be on my full band show, since really the first time since You Can Tell Georgia, he sort of lost the coin toss and had to play drums (laughs). So, he’s on this tour. He’s opening the shows for this tour but he’s also playing drums and other instruments as well throughout the show and he won’t be opening for that showcase, but he’ll be playing with me.
LJ: I’ll definitely be there, so I hope you play that song for me.
JP: Oh, beautiful. Alright, I’ll see what I can do.
LJ: That’s my formal request (laughs).
JP: Alright, I like it (laughs). That’s good. I could start to carve out a set list now.
LJ: Great! (laughs) How do you create your set list?
JP: All different ways. Usually I don’t at all, but when I have a band with me I kinda have to try to at least have some kind of an idea of what we’re gonna play one after the other, just because it’s hard on the guys who are switching instruments too much, and if my set list doesn’t really jive with that and they have to switch over too many times… but anyway, yeah. Sometimes I just start with a song that I think would be nice to open with and then I just think about what would sound good after that. Ya know, maybe play a few lines of the last bit, kind of the way you sequence a record I guess, similarly anyway, and think about what kind of arc you have I suppose – whether you want it to go up or you want it to go down or you want it to be a little reprieve from fast stuff or you want it to be a reprieve from slow stuff or sad stuff or whatever it might be and you can throw something different in there.
LJ: Yeah. Definitely. I want to ask you about how you’ve remained unsigned and have achieved such a great level of success. I read that you said something along the lines of that you figured out really early on that as long as you’re doing what makes you happy, that you’d be happy living in a cardboard box.
JP: (laughs) Yeah, I may have said something like that.
LJ: I perceive a really strong sense of faith and confidence from that, and what’s really amazing about it is that you felt that way so early on, since you released your very first album. Is there an experience from your childhood or a part of your upbringing that gave you such a strong sense of faith in personal success rather than financial success?
JP: Well, I’m certainly lucky in my upbringing. My folks are amazing to me and always have been. I definitely had a strong work ethic instilled in me from my father. But part of it also is sort of a naïve, hillbilly confidence that I got when I first started writing songs, because I was surprised when one fell out. Ya know, I was 21 years old before I wrote my first song and when it fell out, it was a surprise, and so, but when it did, I was like “Oh, this is what I’m gonna do,” and so I wrote 10 more that week and the next week I recorded it and that was my first record.
LJ: Wow.
JP: And ya know because it was the first thing that ever really fell out of me that I really felt like I was good at, that I had some ease with and I knew that I had some talent for. I think I might have thought I was a little better than I was (laughs). And I just figured, well, this is what I’m supposed to do, so I don’t really have to worry about anything because it was pretty easy to see that this is what I’m made to do, ya know, over anything else. This is my strong suit. It was a huge relief to not be searching for what you’re supposed to do in life, ya know, what career you’re gonna have, what you’re gonna do with your life, what makes you feel good, how you’re gonna survive – all that. I just felt like well, that’s it, that’s what I’ll do. Whatever it takes and puttin’ all your energy…just deciding on something and putting all your energy into that, is such a great asset in itself because your not putting all your energy into a bunch of different places, hoping something will take. You’re just doing one thing and you’re focused on the one thing and you believe, and you know and you have no doubts that’s what your supposed to be doing, then it kind of makes it easier in a way, and it does kind of fall together that way. And I think I thought I was good enough, and I didn’t care what anyone was saying about how they thought the record should sound and, well, now they’ll give me this much money to re-record those songs with this producer. I had more songs to write. I was making up for lost time. I had a lot more songs to give and I didn’t want to slow down to re-record old songs that I felt were already done and already recorded. Like, let me record new ones… and so I think that part of that naïve hillbilly confidence that I had in my abilities is kind of what got me through, and the reason I have a career is because I just made a lot of records in a small amount of time and I didn’t give them to anybody. Ya know, they’re mine and so when you don’t give your catalog away to a record label, the funny thing is that when you sell a record you actually make money from it. All the money comes to you, so yeah, I’d love to take credit for it, but it was really more of an accident of just being a hillbilly (laughs).
LJ: I can relate to that completely. With Heartstrings… that’s how I got into it. I dove head first into it because it came naturally. It was a mixture of everything I’ve ever wanted to do. But I have to admit that there are definitely times when I struggle with the financial realities of pursuing your passion solely for your passion’s sake. It’s hard dealing with that. It’s admirable that you have been so committed to that ethic and were able to be successful with it as well.
JP: Well, thank you. That’s nice of you to say. I’ve had some times that were rough too, and I also got very lucky as well, that it worked out the way that it did, but um… I do think that if you have enough…if you can eliminate that question from your mind… if it’s what you love to do, and you know you’re good at it, that’s what you’re meant to do… and if you can take that bit of doubt out of the equation, then you just realize that regardless of money or anything else, you’re ahead of the game. You’re ahead of most people, because you found what you want to do in life, as opposed to what you have to do in life. And if that’s what you want to do in life, and you’re getting to do it, no matter what the money is it’s gonna work itself out.
LJ: It’s happening right now.
JP: That’s beautiful.
LJ: Talking to you is part of that, for me at least.
JP: Well, good. I should be congratulating you then!
LJ: I guess so! (laughs)
JP: Yeah. Good girl.
LJ: (laughs) Thanks Joe. On a similar note, a couple of your songs have been on Grey’s Anatomy and you have the background with the producer of Lost. This accomplishment along with how, when you first started selling albums you made your music affordable for whoever your buyer was… if someone couldn’t afford it, you’d give it away… what’s it like dealing with those extremes – giving your albums away to people who can’t afford to buy them and then selling millions of one song?
JP: (laughs) It’s a bit of a contrast I suppose, but it also felt like a little bit of a reassurance or an affirmation that I was doing the right thing and that I had done the right thing. The reason being, ya know, the producer of that show was in a restaurant, ya know, listening to a burnt CD copy that I had given away when he heard that, when he heard any song from me. And then got a hold of me and asked me to do a song for that show [Lost] and that was the story of itself. I was in upstate New York, making a record, but I wasn’t trying to make a record, I was just making a little documentation of my time there, and it was just a few days and I wrote about my time with the River folks there and everything and then he called and asked for a similar song to what I’d already just written. So I said how about this one, and he said perfect. So, that’s how that came about, but it certainly came from giving it away in the first place.
LJ: That’s amazing. Pay it forward.
JP: Yeah, you bet.
LJ: I heard you released your 11th album on June 28, 2010 at 4 AM, because that’s when you finished it.
JP: Right (laughs).
LJ: How did that happen? Were you just so excited to finish it that you had to release it right then and there?
JP: Yeah, sure! Well, that’s the thing about technology. I finish something and send it over to my manager Brian Klein and… I was like, “Here it is. Put it up,” ya know, because we can. Really, the only answer to that is because we could. Because we’re not tied down by the record label or a release date and put this much promotion into it before hand, which is surely the smart way to do things, I’m sure, but I just can’t operate under those kind of conditions. If I made it, I want it to be up there right away and luckily, I’m able to do that. Because I want to make more and I feel like if it’s not out, then I don’t really have to make more. But if I put it out, then it’s time to make more.
LJ: So do you feel like you have to release something in order to move on in some ways?
JP: Yeah, probably. Definitely. It’s not a golden rule for me. I mean, I’ve done it other ways. I have a little double record I made before the one I just released and I haven’t released it yet and I’m not sure when I will or if I will, but on average, yeah, I like to do things quickly and have it be out there in the world and let people decide for themselves whether they like it and then move on, and make more. ’cause that’s the part that… I don’t know, that’s the part that fulfills me – is making art. It’s not the rest of it. It’s just art for art’s sake. Which is, if you can operate under those guidelines, then that’s what makes you happy and so the rest of it will fall into place eventually. Or not, and fuck it if it doesn’t (laughs).
LJ: (laughs) Well, my next question was going to be whether self-criticism ever comes into play, but I think that answers that. I guess it just doesn’t matter.
JP: Yeah. I suppose so (laughs) No, it doesn’t matter. Really doesn’t.
LJ: In more than one place, I saw your collection of albums referred to as a “travel guide.”
JP: Oh, yeah?
LJ: Yeah. How do you feel about that description? Is it a good reference?
JP: Sure. It’s a good reference for me. I don’t know if it would be a good reference for anybody else, as a tour guide situation, but it’s from places that have inspired me or places that I found to be very beautiful, or places or important things in my life that have happened. Things that have made an impression on me.
LJ: I think that’s why they said it. I think it’s clear, with the number of albums, that you sort of take advantage, and I mean this in the best way possible, of wherever you are and whatever you’re experiencing and because you’re able to release something on your own accord, you do that.
JP: Absolutely. Yes, ma’am. I try to anyway.
LJ: Do you have a favorite album of yours, or is that too tough of a question to answer?
JP: I mean, it’s a tough one. I have different parts of different ones that are favorites for different reasons, but it mostly has to do with some kind of breakthrough in writing, or acquiring some kind of tool that I hadn’t done before. Writing a certain kind of song that I hadn’t quite been able to find a way to do before. Ya know, on this one, this last one, I kind of found my rhythm with a little bit of a talking blues number, which I had never been able to do without sounding cheesy, so I just never did it. Um, but, adding a little bit of levity to the songs and not just having them be straight sad songs, um, is something I’m kind of a little more proud of on this last run… that there’s actually, even if there’s a hard situation for me, there is humor in everything, which provides a little bit of levity in the record and in the material. Um, but you know, different ones for different reasons. This American was something that I went out into New Mexico, brought myself with some recording gear for a week and turned that out and ya know, at the time I was very very proud of that one and but again, for different reasons, the ones that were made ya know with the guys when we were travelling and being able to pull off a, ya know, You Can Tell Georgia or Paris in the Morning or Take My Blanket and Go in a matter of 3 or 4 days, um, in a studio we’ve never been to. Just stopping in, off of tour, because that’s all we could afford and those have their own things that I love about them as well. And the locations where they were and the things they make me think of, it is a diary I guess for me. But then again, I don’t listen to those, I don’t listen to my records really, unless I’m trying to remember the words to some of them.
LJ: It sounds like there’s a lot going on in the background where you are right now.
JP: Yeah. I’m at Georgia Majestic Lounge in Fayetteville, Arkansas. They’re calling me in.
LJ: That’s the venue you’re playing at tonight?
JP: Yeah.
LJ: I’ll let you go then, I’m sure you have a lot to do.
JP: Oh well, yeah. It was really nice talking with you. Will I see you in Nashville then?
LJ: Yeah, I’ll definitely be at the show and if I see you cross my path, I’ll definitely stop you (laughs).
JP: Yeah, please do, please do. It’d be great to see you.
LJ: Okay cool! Good luck tonight and thank you so much for taking time to talk to me.
JP: No, thank you! Thank you. You’re very good at what you do, so keep doing it.
LJ: Thanks Joe. I appreciate your saying that. Just one last thing… your voicemail is a riot.
JP: Ohhh (laughs) right. Right. I forgot about that (laughs).
LJ: It made me laugh a bunch. It’s very genuine and sincere….and funny (laughs).
JP: Oh good, well, at least I got that (laughs). I’m glad, and thanks for calling me. Hit me up any time.
LJ: Thanks again.
JP: Thank you. Take care. I’ll see you soon.
♦
We all have a lesson to learn from Joe Purdy. There is no separation between Joe Purdy the musician and Joe Purdy the man. In fact, Joe’s personality can be summed up by that lengthy voice message I connected with on his cell phone prior to our interview. He’s honest, gracious, funny and above all, true to himself and to others, through and through. 10 years and 13 albums later, there’s no denying it. The Americana music community is fortunate to have Joe Purdy — an artist who discovered early on that creating music is what he wants to do, and who has proven that by pursuing it at all costs, he was able to avoid doing what others might think he would otherwise have to do. With that ethic, Joe has made his music available to us — from the self-titled Joe Purdy (2001) to Eagle Rock Fire (2014) — straight from his heartstrings to ours. Perhaps it all derives from, as he calls it, the “hillbilly confidence” he’s had ever since his first song “fell out.” Whatever the source, I’m sure that I speak for all of us when I say that we look forward to hearing from Joe again, “at some point in the future,” just as he promised.
AmericanaFest 2014 – Nashville, Tennessee
Our arrival at AmericanaFest on Wednesday began the way it always does — with a celebratory local beverage. We knew Yazoo Brewing Company had crafted a smoked IPA just for AmericanaFest and dubbed it simply, “Americana,” so that us crazed festival goers could not only listen and talk Americana, but drink it too.
With the assurance that we would inevitably sample Yazoo’s “Americana” free of charge at the festival’s upcoming parties and BBQs, we headed to Jackalope Brewing Company on 8th Avenue S.
The bartender greeted us, wearing a Jackalope shirt with a message on the front, which, in just three short words, would foretell the events and our experiences to follow over the next 4 days. The Jackalope message reads:
DO
EPIC
SHIT
And we did.
Keep your eyes focused here on Heartstrings in the days to come. While recovering from severe AmericanaFest withdrawal, we will post coverage of some of our favorite venues, performances and our amazing interviews with Joe Purdy, Israel Nash, Joe Pug, Jonah Tolchin, Nathaniel Rateliff, along with notable and unexpected encounters and our reviews of local eateries, accommodations, transportation (in case your wondering about all those large pink mustaches you saw on the grills of passing cars) and hotspots for good old-fashioned Tennessee warmth and hospitality.
Interview: An Afternoon with Gregory Alan Isakov
Gregory Alan Isakov on the Woods Stage at Pickathon 2014
(Photos: Lauren Jahoda)
In anticipation of his upcoming showcase at AmericanaFest, we interviewed Gregory Alan Isakov about everything from stealing lines from himself, his harmonica mic and his vow to never watch a video of himself to his Colorado farm and his degree in horticulture. We were even able to discuss two of many GAI favorites — “All Shades of Blue” and “If I Go, I’m Goin.” To top it off…well you’ll have to wait and see, but all I’ll say is that there was no shortage of singing during our Thursday afternoon conversation.
During our interview, I told Greg that I felt his trademark is without a doubt his use of the harmonica mic for some of his vocals. The truth is that there is a quality to Greg’s music which projects far greater than that marvelous vintage tone coming from his harmonica mic. Rather, his trademark lies in his ability to access an ultra-private and intimate place, one of which we, like Greg, can say “I’ve only experienced by myself.” There is relevance to every listener in every GAI song, making it a shared and peaceful endeavor; three to five minutes of unrestrained communication. As Greg told me, “It seems almost impossible, but it’s totally amazing when it happens.”
Greg takes the stage at Third Man Records at 9 PM this Thursday, during this year’s AmericanaFest in Nashville, Tennessee. His showcase will be one OF his last US shows before his extensive European tour this fall, and thus this performance is an opportunity that should rise to the very top of everyone’s AmericanaFest schedule.
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Lauren Jahoda: You have 3 full-length albums so far and that’s a lot to choose from when making your set list for a show. How do you choose which songs you’re going to play for a particular venue? Does it vary? Do you pull from one album more than another?
Gregory Alan Isakov: My manager would probably want me to push a certain record but I never do that. I walk into the room for sound check and I usually scribble a little set list right before we go on, once I see the room, because there’s always this balance between what I’m really feeling and what we can get away with in a space. Lately, we have been so lucky being able to get away with songs that might be really slow or really quiet. But sometimes, you can’t get away with those and you sort of have to play the room, and that’s a whole craft in itself – choosing the right music for that evening or room. I usually never stick to a set list much, but I definitely pay attention to how I open the show a lot, and I try to do that as intimately as possible.
LJ: It’s nice to hear that because you generally assume the artist is going to play the most recent material, from the most recent album. I was at Pickathon and I saw both your performances, which were full of the old stuff too, which I love.
GAI: Oh, yea. Thank you. It never feels tired. Playing live is such an amazing thing because every time we do, it feels new, especially when there’s a group of people that you are playing with all the time, because you feel like you can be present with them.
LJ: Every performance has it’s own fingerprint. They’re never the same.
GAI: Never the same.
LJ: Seeing you play so many times over the past several years, I’ve noticed that you often remind the audience at the beginning of the performance that the guys up there on stage with you are your closest friends.
GAI: Yeah. When I started writing songs, I just played by myself wherever, and then I noticed that the people that were my friends, who I was just around, I ended up playing music with, while we we’re all living in the same building, which is how I met my band. It just felt regular as opposed to seeking out these great players from Nashville or wherever. It’s was way more important to me I think and I just got weird-lucky because they’re amazing and we’ve all kind of grown a lot together playing. So I think about that when I’m writing.
LJ: I love to hear you say that. It’s very comforting as a spectator because I feel the performance I’m getting on stage is the same performance you guys are creating in your living room. It’s an insider look.
GAI: Yeah. It does feel that way. That’s important me. That’s cool. I’ve never heard that before. That’s cool.
LJ: This may sound a bit gushy — I think Steve Varney is just about the best banjo player I’ve ever heard.
GAI: Isn’t he? And he would laugh at you so hard because he’s just like “I’m just fakin’ it.” He was just a guitar player and he’s just a killer, killer musician. He’s got such great taste.
LJ: He’s really amazing and seems so versatile.
GAI: He totally is. He’s amazing.
LJ: When you guys did Serialbox Presents, I saw the video you did for “Saint Valentine,” but then you also recorded “Big Black Car.” You have to scroll to the very bottom of the screen to find it, but I have to tell you, I probably listened to it about 100 times in a row because the banjo in it is just so haunting.
GAI: I never watch those. We worked so hard on that arrangement with the banjo because I play banjo on all our recordings and I think it took Steve awhile to figure out how…because at first, I was like no, no you’re too good, can we put a pencil in your hand? And then he took my aesthetic of banjo and did his own thing, which I really love.
LJ: So you never watched the video for SerialBox?
GAI: (laughs) No, I haven’t. I don’t really watch videos of myself ever.
LJ: Why is that?
GAI: I think I tried that a couple of years ago and I remember feeling… the next time I was on stage I felt really self-conscious and said I’m never going to watch myself again (laughs).
LJ: Well that’s commitment, I have to say.
GAI: I live on a farm and I don’t have Internet, which is actually a blessing. If I have to do work or whatever, I have to go to the coffee shop. It’s just one of those things– the last thing I need is more about myself (laughs).
LJ: Are you based in Colorado? Is that where your farm is?
GAI: Yeah.
LJ: Do you plan on going back to Nederland to record your next album?
GAI: Oh yeah. I’m actually writing now. Jamie, our engineer and producer, he also does sound for us when we tour, he lives here on the farm as well, in a trailer, and right now we’re building a studio here in the barn and so our goal is to record here, but we’ll definitely be going back up to the mountain house to do mixing.
LJ: You were born in Johannesburg, South Africa. How long were you there?
GAI: I was there ‘til I was almost 7. So I definitely have a very distinct memory of before and after. I’ve been back there once since I left with my family, and we still have some family there but a lot of us moved all over the world during the apartheid, so we have family in Australia and Canada and all over the place.
LJ: Is that where some of your album art aesthetic comes from?
GAI: I’ve never thought about it.
LJ: I get this 1920s/1930s Wright Brothers feeling to it, myself.
GAI: Yeah, I don’t know where…It’s funny, all the stuff that we’re drawn to. The aesthetic is so interesting. I was just having this conversation with a friend of mine. We were talking about music and how in Colorado there’s a big bluegrass scene and bluegrass has always had a sports vibe to me (laughs). Like how fast can you play!! (laughs) And then you’ll hear a song that holds one chord and it will keel you over and how little playing fast matters, ya know. Most of it is just a sense of aesthetic really, how important that is. I don’t know where it comes from. It’s so weird the stuff that we like. I don’t know why we like what we like.
LJ: It’s so prominent too, which is even funnier. I was looking at your albums and they kind of all have it in their own way. I love it, I think it fits really well even though we might not know what it is.
GAI: Yeah, totally.
LJ: Your brother — I remembering you saying at a show that he writes songs with you. What’s that like? What’s the process?
GAI: It’s awesome. He’s just like this weirdo-genius kid. He used to live with me in the summers and then go back to Pennsylvania to work. He teaches piano and writes scores for documentary films. But he’ll like break out a mandolin and just sing. We wrote a song called “Second Chances” together and so he has that like…you know, on the mandolin one day and he’s just playing it and… (sings) “If weren’t for second chances, we’d all be alone,” you know, on the mandolin, and I was like, I didn’t even know you played the mandolin! (laughs). So then I was like, hold on and I ran outside, and I wrote the verses…I ran in the garden and wrote the verses, came back in and we finished that song real fast. But a lot of times, he’ll have these seeds that I think are just brilliant that he might not even pay any attention to. He’s just amazing.
LJ: Yeah. Sometimes you need someone to pick it up for you and it works out really well. That must be an awesome experience.
GAI: Yea, it’s really cool. I’m really close with my brothers. I have two brothers and we’re best friends. It’s awesome.
LJ: That’s funny. I’m one of three girls so I know what it’s like.
GAI: Really?
LJ: Are you the middle child?
GAI: I am, yeah.
LJ: I am also.
GAI: Oohh, that’s awesome! I got lucky that way.
LJ: It is kind of a cool role.
LJ: I really like the female vocal in That Moon Song. Who is that?
GAI: She sings back up on This Empty Northern Hemisphere. Her name is Brandi Carlisle. She’s amazing and she’s a really good friend of mine. Her voice fucking belongs in a museum or something. She’s amazing. She’s such an inspiring artist to me. Her energy and her musicality is mind-blowing to me.
LJ: The two of you together on that song – it’s enchanting.
GAI: Yea, she’s got it, and those were one-takes. I just saw her play actually. I was on a long camping trip in my van. I saw her play for the Portland Symphony. It was so awesome.
LJ: Let’s talk about your sound from the two microphones you use while performing — I consider that your signature. How did it come about?
GAI: I love camping in the wilderness and for me music was never a plan as a career. I was in horticulture school. I loved the wilderness. I loved camping and so I would go on long camping trips and I’d play at coffee shops to pay for gas. I’d do one show in Bozeman for 15 people and try to sell 10 CDs and then do Missoula 5 days later (laughs). I’d end up playing these gigs at bars and you’d get 9 PM to midnight or 1 AM, so 3 1/2 hour shows…that’s a lot of music. I’d have to learn a couple of covers but a lot of them are original and I used to play through a harmonica mic and then I just started singing through it just to give myself a break during a 3 ½ hr show. Then I got really into the sound of it. Within a year after that, I started writing for that microphone. Kind of like this subconscious voice I had that seemed to really work. And that mic is a piece of crap. I’ve re-soldered it so many times. They’re really cheap harmonica mics. It’s not going through anything, it’s just going through the house which is great. And Jamie has a love/hate relationship with it because it feeds back a lot so…(laughs)
LJ: I love it. It’s definitely your trademark.
GAI: Yeah. That’s cool. It sort of just happened because I was tired of hearing myself for the 3 ½ hours (laughs).
LJ: About your degree in horticulture — I view gardening and horticulture as a very emotional and sentimental activity that is often passed down from generation to generation. How did you get into it?
GAI: I dropped out of high school and I ended up moving to the city with my drummer, in Philly, and I realized oh man, I can’t live in the city ever. I ended up kind of falling into this really dark place for quite a long time, and a friend of mine said “Hey, I’m going to hike some of the Appalachian trail, do you want to come?” And I didn’t know anything about hiking and camping, and we went to K-Mart or something and I bought a bag and the first 10 days I had canned food. I didn’t know anything about backpacking and we were out there for a long time, and I don’t know, I just woke up to the scent of the natural world and plants in general where I just felt this really strong connection to plants. And my granny, my grandmother was a gardener and I grew up gardening a little bit. But it never had that kind of profound effect on me and even then I didn’t know why I was so drawn to working with plants. I still don’t get it. The weirdo new-age hippy part of my brain it goes “Cool. Well, maybe the earth needs more of those and they made you like it,” you know? (laughs). It’s a weird thing to love but, it’s a huge part of my life.
LJ: You were in the right place at the right time. You sort of needed to be in that moment to be grabbed by something else.
GAI: Yeah. I think when I first had my first vegetable garden around that time. I thought man, I’ve never even tasted food before. I don’t think I’ve ever really known what food was actually like until I was picking it out of the garden.
LJ: I know what you mean.
GAI: It was a cool feeling.
LJ: I met a friend at Pickathon. Apparently he’s a mutual friend of ours. His name is Asher. He said you used to play at a place called The Gryphon Café. Was that a pivotal place in your career?
GAI: Oh yeah. I love Asher. He’s a really old friend of mine from back in those days. Gryphon was an old school coffeehouse that you would picture in the 60s at that time. You could smoke upstairs. There were all these shows every night and all the little vagrant kids would hang out there all the time. We would always cut high school and hang out there all day. It was that place.
LJ: This is a personal question, but I have to ask it. Who do you write about?
GAI: I don’t think it’s a specific person. I’m not in a relationship or married or anything like that. The characters that make it in to the songs are a mixture of people that are either from my past or that I meet here and there. A song about a town might be maybe about really three or four different places. For me, songwriting is never quite that literal. Even when I go for that, when I try, and say like “I’m going to write a story song like Springsteen” or something, that’s a hard thing for me to do for some reason and it never feels like the songs write themselves that way, in my experience and yeah, there are definitely pieces of people in all the songs I write.
LJ: Can I ask you about “All Shades of Blue”? How did you come up with that? That’s a favorite of mine.
GAI: Oh, really, I love that song too. Actually, I was just fishing in Colorado, here in Lyons, with my dear friend Annie and we were working…and my friend Johann, a friend in Austin, we’re super nerdy together — we write a lot of songs together, and we were fishing and I had just come up with …(sings) “when the wine stop workin’ and you’re all run out and all of your high hopes have all headed south…” and then he would be like…“and the songs left the stable…” — and it’s funny, because he’s like, that’s something you would write (laughs) and so we just started swapping these lines and that song just kind of wrote itself and is like, really strong.
LJ: That makes sense because before the song officially came out, I watched a video of you performing it and the lyrics were different than what’s on the album, slightly.
GAI: Oh, yeah, I know. This is a problem that I have. (laughs) This happens to me all time. Which, I don’t think people were as worried about before YouTube or whatever. But, a really huge way for me to finish songs is for me is to play them live. Last night, we booked a secret show, just last minute at a bar. So we played for a couple of hours at this little bar here, just for about 20 or 30 people that were there and I was just playing new songs just to see how they were gonna happen, and I remember that’s how I used to write a lot…just kind of in that moment of that pressure, of like okay just finish…your kind of like pleading the song to finish itself. It’s a really good tool for me to finish songs because I have a lot of starts and sometimes they don’t finish themselves unless I put ’em on the spot. I think that song kind of found its words later after playing it out a bunch and figuring out what sang well. And then another problem that I have is that I’ll steal lines from myself all the time. I’ll finish a song and then later thing this is where that “cut down the cottonwoods” line should go, and then I’ll write something else for that other tune (laughs). I do it all the time. It’s a problem (laughs). I steal lines from myself all the time.
LJ: I think that’s the best case scenario.
GAI: (laughs) Yeah.
LJ: Another song that stays with me a lot is “If I Go, I’m Goin”.
GAI: Oh yeah, that’s another song I wrote with Johann. You should check out his music. It’s really cool. He goes under J. Wagner. He’s from Austin and he’s such a solid songwriter. He’s kind of like a Steinbeck with his songwriting. He just has that about him and we write together a lot. He’ll say “We can’t use the words ghost or moon!” (laughs). We’ll walk around town and spend like $9 on coffee or whatever, because we’re going after that one line and it could take all day (laughs). That’s really fun. “If I Go” we wrote on a long trip down to Kerrville, TX and Johann goes down there and we just kind of meet up and hang out for a few weeks and I had my truck and we just kinda sat in the back of the truck and then we’re working on the verses and chorus and we’re up to this part where it’s …(sings) “I will go, if you ask me to…” and then this guy John, our friend John Eliot, just walks by and he’s like ..”I’ll stay if you dare!” And we’re like “alright!” (laughs). He’s another great musician, and then he just disappears into the…and he’s just gone (laughs). That whole song was a co-write. All 3 of us. And then John came in at the end and sort of helped us a little bit more with it. That song happened pretty fast. We were trying to write a song, we after writing a story song about a woman, or about a guy who lost his wife and he was living in that house where she had died and he kinda goes crazy.
LJ: That’s amazing to me because I think about what it feels like listening to that song. It feels like such a lonely, personal, haunting, intimate song, and yet you wrote it collaboratively.
GAI: It’s amazing to me too. I know. I never would have thought working with other people, other writers, that you could actually access that place where I’ve only experienced by myself. It seems almost impossible, but it’s totally amazing when it happens.
LJ: It’s an amazing song. Would you mind singing something for me now, that you’ve already released or maybe something you haven’t released?
GAI: Yeah sure. Ah, let’s see, I can play you the morning…this morning’s song.
LJ: It’s called “This Morning”?
GAI: Oh, no…it’s this one I worked on this morning (laughs).
LJ: (laughs) maybe you should name it This Morning!
GAI: Alright, let’s do This Morning Song….
—
At this point GAI took out his headphones, picked up his guitar and began to sing and play what even he was now calling “This Morning Song,” i.e. the song which was so new, it was otherwise yet to be titled.
As I listened, I reflected on how effortless and enjoyable our time talking on the phone had been, and it occurred to me that, it just simply makes sense that Gregory is as genuine and engaging in conversation as he is when speaking through his music. When you are genuine, it can be no other way. And now, his newest song, which quite possibly no one else had ever heard him play, was dancing around the room I was in– as passionately delivered and as stunning as any of the performances I’d enjoyed in venues packed with full audiences. But this time it was just me, “on the phone with Greg,” having a private live concert of the song he had just created in the morning hours before our call. I don’t hesitate to gush. The experience was surreal, and I marveled at his ability to instantaneously transition from thoroughly engaging light-hearted conversation, to full-on, deeply-passionate immersion into his craft. I thought “pure genius, at the flick of a switch.” But it’s not that at all. The genius and genuineness are ever present. Always at the ready. Inherent. I’d heard it before, and I am even more certain of it now.
If you’ve heard his music, then you know what it’s like too. When you hear a GAI song, it only takes a moment to know that it’s a GAI song, and with every album, he gives us something new within the frame work of that familiar magic. There’s a strikingly unusual chord in the new song. One I’d not heard him use before. It resurfaced briefly within the progression of each verse, and each time it came back around I could hear the master working, assimilating it into the familiar magic of his sound, even transforming the chord itself into “a GAI chord” — hauntingly beautiful.
I don’t know if “This Morning Song” will ever officially be the title for the new song or when his next album might be released, but I do know that this artist continues to bring us great music at it’s genuine best.
Again, don’t forget to catch Greg’s performance at Third Man Records during AmericanaFest, Thursday (9/18) at 9 PM.
HEARTSTRINGS MAGAZINE 